First, I deeply appreciate Jesse running this interview. Eileen McCarron is an incredible leader who has been working extremely hard on this issue for decades. Her work deserves far more attention than that of Here 4 the Kids, and it is sad that many of those in media chase what is flashy more than what is important.
Second, I'm a marketing idiot and forgot to plug GVPedia's Substack in addition to the GVPedia website: (armedwithreason.substack.com).
Third, to indirectly respond to some of the comments, Eileen is a very evidence based. If a policy doesn't work, she doesn't pursue it. In terms of the impact of weakening concealed carry laws (from may-issue to shall-issue, and more recently from shall-issue to permitless carry), here is a summary from 2021 (while 2 years old, the academic evidence has grown even stronger since then):
"From 1997-2021, 65 academic studies on concealed carry laws and their impact on violent crime have been published: 18 find a decrease, 21 find no effect (or mixed), and 26 find an increase. Forty percent of studies find that loosening concealed carry laws has a detrimental effect on crime, which is a plurality. Only 28% find a beneficial impact....
Since the 2005 NRC report, 35 studies were conducted on loosening concealed carry laws, five of which find a decrease, seven find no effect (or mixed), and 23 find an increase in crime. In summary, 66% of the modern academic literature finds that loosening concealed carry laws has a detrimental effect on crime, while only 14% finds a beneficial impact."
The primary causal pathway for this is through increased gun thefts as more people carry with ever decreasing amounts of required training. A firearm is vastly more likely to be used to harm its owner, the owner's loved ones, or be stolen than to be used in self defense (and before you cite Kleck, the NRC report, or the "CDC study," I've written a 12 part series on this for our Substack, which is summarized with helpful links here: https://www.gvpedia.org/dgu-lie/).
If you still want to have a gun for self-defense, that is your right. Just please be aware of the risk, securely store it, and do more training than required (which in most states now is 0).
I live in Florida, a place everyone thinks is Super Gun Central. I’m from Indiana, which has ten times the gun culture Florida does.
businesses are cancelling conventions here because of the recently passed unlicensed carry law--which over half the states have, and had before we did.
No, but seriously, if they don’t realize how ridiculous that sounds to the average normie who they need to win over to build any kind of momentum as a movement, then they are out of their minds. Anybody working at a non-profit could tell you that your goals need to be specific, measurable, attainable, relevant, and time-bound. Banning the human inclination to do evil that has been present since we climbed out of the primordial ooze is…none of those.
That statement, more than anything else, shows me they are not a serious organization and they have no actual intention of moving the needle on gun crime, climate change, or anything else other than their own publicity.
Lmao H4TK's first response to you is that good old word salad "rooted in white supremacy and anti blackness". Is there anything that they think that doesn't apply to?
While I disagree with McCarron on guns, she, on the whole, seems reasonable and someone with whom one could have a productive discussion on guns. (I say "seems" because I don't believe she said at any point in this what her specific end metrics and/or policies are, so it's possible she just has slightly-less-crazy aims than H4TK, but based on the rest of the interview, I don't think that's the case).
And then there's H4TK and Strawn. Just... Jesus Christ. How can anyone actually believe the things she, and by extension H4TK, says? Just complete extreme-left word vomit.
This was a great article. There's a disincentive to follow local news these days, given people's attention to national issues. So, I'm a Coloradan who had no information about people like McCarron. I don't have well-formulated opinions about guns, so that prevents me from participating in activist causes. But I worked on the March for Science here in Denver, and I wish I could have worked with someone like her on that problem because what I experienced was frustrating and underwhelming in the long run.
Jesse, I know it's difficult, but I hope you continue to bring attention to local issues like this and reasonable people like McCarron. It would make me, and I think others, more hopeful about the country's direction.
Saira Rao is a sleazy grifter. She exploited her version of 'racism' until it was no long profitable. So she moved on the gun control. I predict that she will move on to 'new, new' thing when her latest grift is no longer paying dividends. Actually, she already has, 'climate change' is her latest grift. What is her next grift? I don't know.
The thing with people like Saira Rao is that success is the last thing they need. Rather like the Democrat & media establishment's need for Trump, the point is all in the performance.
Anyway, I would like you all to send me money for my brilliant and very caring new organisation SABTRN4E. Stop All Bad Things Right Now For Everyone will not rest until every bad thing is stopped for everyone. If you don't support this, you are in favour of all bad things.
I remember hearing about this when Rao was shaming white women for travelling to see Taylor Swift in concert instead of flying out to support her protest in Colorado. I sometimes wonder about the damage she did even with that one unhinged statement.
Anyway, great article and interview! McCarron’s reasonableness and deep knowledge about this issue was a salve to the teeth-grinding I was doing reading about Rao attempting to set back yet another movement by 100 years.
Love this, and appreciate you getting deep into the sausage-making. McCarron's combination of deeply-held conviction and unwillingness to badmouth or burn any bridge was a pleasure to read.
The sheriffs in Washington have also unilaterally refused to enforce many firearm laws in the past few years. Sheriffs in the US are startlingly unaccountable to the State, which means elections are the only way to punish them for deciding to take the Constitution into their own hands. Of course, some counties find this more palatable than others. But the sheriffs' actions sure pushed me further toward a hardline anti-gun position than I had been before.
Kinda ironic that Rao believes she can bypass normal protocol and go straight to demanding action from the president. If that isn’t *Karen asking to speak to the manager*, I don’t know what is.
I live in Texas and we have a huge gun culture here. The state was founded by people who had nothing but their guns to defend against outlaws & indigenous tribes who would not hesitate to torture and kill them. Texas put the "wild" in the Wild West, and it hasn't been tamed much since.
Guns represent safety and independence to millions of Americans.
When activists talk about restricting guns, many people hear that their safety and independence will be restricted. It frightens them.
Any law with the word "ban" in it will inflame those fears.
Any attempts to enforce a gun ban would turn huge parts of the country into the Branch Davidian debacle.
Slow and steady wins the race when it comes to reasonable gun control in this country.
But fast and hysterical gets media attention and twitter likes, so I'm not holding my breath.
A Longtime Colorado Gun Reform Activist Explains What Happened When Saira Rao’s Here 4 The Kids Parachuted Into Her Issue
I'm the Devin Hughes mentioned in the article.
First, I deeply appreciate Jesse running this interview. Eileen McCarron is an incredible leader who has been working extremely hard on this issue for decades. Her work deserves far more attention than that of Here 4 the Kids, and it is sad that many of those in media chase what is flashy more than what is important.
Second, I'm a marketing idiot and forgot to plug GVPedia's Substack in addition to the GVPedia website: (armedwithreason.substack.com).
Third, to indirectly respond to some of the comments, Eileen is a very evidence based. If a policy doesn't work, she doesn't pursue it. In terms of the impact of weakening concealed carry laws (from may-issue to shall-issue, and more recently from shall-issue to permitless carry), here is a summary from 2021 (while 2 years old, the academic evidence has grown even stronger since then):
"From 1997-2021, 65 academic studies on concealed carry laws and their impact on violent crime have been published: 18 find a decrease, 21 find no effect (or mixed), and 26 find an increase. Forty percent of studies find that loosening concealed carry laws has a detrimental effect on crime, which is a plurality. Only 28% find a beneficial impact....
Since the 2005 NRC report, 35 studies were conducted on loosening concealed carry laws, five of which find a decrease, seven find no effect (or mixed), and 23 find an increase in crime. In summary, 66% of the modern academic literature finds that loosening concealed carry laws has a detrimental effect on crime, while only 14% finds a beneficial impact."
https://www.gvpedia.org/clarifying-misinformation-in-nysrpa-v-bruen-amicus-briefs/ (the list of studies is at the end of the admittedly quite long post)
The primary causal pathway for this is through increased gun thefts as more people carry with ever decreasing amounts of required training. A firearm is vastly more likely to be used to harm its owner, the owner's loved ones, or be stolen than to be used in self defense (and before you cite Kleck, the NRC report, or the "CDC study," I've written a 12 part series on this for our Substack, which is summarized with helpful links here: https://www.gvpedia.org/dgu-lie/).
If you still want to have a gun for self-defense, that is your right. Just please be aware of the risk, securely store it, and do more training than required (which in most states now is 0).
I live in Florida, a place everyone thinks is Super Gun Central. I’m from Indiana, which has ten times the gun culture Florida does.
businesses are cancelling conventions here because of the recently passed unlicensed carry law--which over half the states have, and had before we did.
no one knows a damned thing.
“We are here to BAN inhumanity.”
Well, good luck with that.
No, but seriously, if they don’t realize how ridiculous that sounds to the average normie who they need to win over to build any kind of momentum as a movement, then they are out of their minds. Anybody working at a non-profit could tell you that your goals need to be specific, measurable, attainable, relevant, and time-bound. Banning the human inclination to do evil that has been present since we climbed out of the primordial ooze is…none of those.
That statement, more than anything else, shows me they are not a serious organization and they have no actual intention of moving the needle on gun crime, climate change, or anything else other than their own publicity.
Lmao H4TK's first response to you is that good old word salad "rooted in white supremacy and anti blackness". Is there anything that they think that doesn't apply to?
While I disagree with McCarron on guns, she, on the whole, seems reasonable and someone with whom one could have a productive discussion on guns. (I say "seems" because I don't believe she said at any point in this what her specific end metrics and/or policies are, so it's possible she just has slightly-less-crazy aims than H4TK, but based on the rest of the interview, I don't think that's the case).
And then there's H4TK and Strawn. Just... Jesus Christ. How can anyone actually believe the things she, and by extension H4TK, says? Just complete extreme-left word vomit.
This was a great article. There's a disincentive to follow local news these days, given people's attention to national issues. So, I'm a Coloradan who had no information about people like McCarron. I don't have well-formulated opinions about guns, so that prevents me from participating in activist causes. But I worked on the March for Science here in Denver, and I wish I could have worked with someone like her on that problem because what I experienced was frustrating and underwhelming in the long run.
Jesse, I know it's difficult, but I hope you continue to bring attention to local issues like this and reasonable people like McCarron. It would make me, and I think others, more hopeful about the country's direction.
Saira Rao is a sleazy grifter. She exploited her version of 'racism' until it was no long profitable. So she moved on the gun control. I predict that she will move on to 'new, new' thing when her latest grift is no longer paying dividends. Actually, she already has, 'climate change' is her latest grift. What is her next grift? I don't know.
The thing with people like Saira Rao is that success is the last thing they need. Rather like the Democrat & media establishment's need for Trump, the point is all in the performance.
Anyway, I would like you all to send me money for my brilliant and very caring new organisation SABTRN4E. Stop All Bad Things Right Now For Everyone will not rest until every bad thing is stopped for everyone. If you don't support this, you are in favour of all bad things.
Hi Folx,
Question- since folks is already gender neutral... what's with the x? Is it just an extra way to obnoxiously telegraph one's politix?
I remember hearing about this when Rao was shaming white women for travelling to see Taylor Swift in concert instead of flying out to support her protest in Colorado. I sometimes wonder about the damage she did even with that one unhinged statement.
Anyway, great article and interview! McCarron’s reasonableness and deep knowledge about this issue was a salve to the teeth-grinding I was doing reading about Rao attempting to set back yet another movement by 100 years.
Love this, and appreciate you getting deep into the sausage-making. McCarron's combination of deeply-held conviction and unwillingness to badmouth or burn any bridge was a pleasure to read.
The sheriffs in Washington have also unilaterally refused to enforce many firearm laws in the past few years. Sheriffs in the US are startlingly unaccountable to the State, which means elections are the only way to punish them for deciding to take the Constitution into their own hands. Of course, some counties find this more palatable than others. But the sheriffs' actions sure pushed me further toward a hardline anti-gun position than I had been before.
H4TK should make their proposal more palatable by also including a fossil-fuel buyback program.
Sure, ban fossil fuel. Let’s go back to burning wood and cut down every forest. Dam up every river so we can bring back water power.
Kinda ironic that Rao believes she can bypass normal protocol and go straight to demanding action from the president. If that isn’t *Karen asking to speak to the manager*, I don’t know what is.
See NM Governor’s attempted end run around the Constitution.
This will not end well.
I live in Texas and we have a huge gun culture here. The state was founded by people who had nothing but their guns to defend against outlaws & indigenous tribes who would not hesitate to torture and kill them. Texas put the "wild" in the Wild West, and it hasn't been tamed much since.
Guns represent safety and independence to millions of Americans.
When activists talk about restricting guns, many people hear that their safety and independence will be restricted. It frightens them.
Any law with the word "ban" in it will inflame those fears.
Any attempts to enforce a gun ban would turn huge parts of the country into the Branch Davidian debacle.
Slow and steady wins the race when it comes to reasonable gun control in this country.
But fast and hysterical gets media attention and twitter likes, so I'm not holding my breath.